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-   -   Child bonus broken? (http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthread.php?t=6041)

Iggy 01-20-2009 11:46 PM

Child bonus broken?
 
Running the 1.6.5 patch on the Atari version.

Specifically, I'm married to Feanora and she's given birth to Serj (+20% DEF). I'm sure he'll grow up to be a fine son, but at the moment I'm not seeing any bonus modifier at all. I can account for each of the 15 points of my current defense score with the items that I have equipped (or the shrines that I've visited). I would expect my actual defense to be 18?

I don't see the defense bonus on my creatures either. Each of them have a straight +15 on their DEF score, so it doesn't appear to be a passthrough bonus either. Or am I just missing something? :confused:

foolstone 01-21-2009 01:04 AM

He add 20% of your basic defence.
when your basic defence little than 5 means u will get ZERO bonus.
BTW:In English Version, description of some items and skills are not so accurate.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Iggy (Post 65434)
Running the 1.6.5 patch on the Atari version.

Specifically, I'm married to Feanora and she's given birth to Serj (+20% DEF). I'm sure he'll grow up to be a fine son, but at the moment I'm not seeing any bonus modifier at all. I can account for each of the 15 points of my current defense score with the items that I have equipped (or the shrines that I've visited). I would expect my actual defense to be 18?

I don't see the defense bonus on my creatures either. Each of them have a straight +15 on their DEF score, so it doesn't appear to be a passthrough bonus either. Or am I just missing something? :confused:


maltz 01-21-2009 03:00 AM

My children are just simply broken.

My first child: +4 scroll
My second child: +6 scroll
My third child: +10 scroll

I say scr* you all.

Ryastar 01-21-2009 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maltz (Post 65445)
My children are just simply broken.

My first child: +4 scroll
My second child: +6 scroll
My third child: +10 scroll

I say scr* you all.

There is no other word for it, that SUCKS.

Divorce your useless child-producing wife and marry someone else (if you are a warrior, i recommend xeona) and don't let that wife have any children, because less than 10% of the child bonuses are actually useful, so an item is almost always better. Xeona gives you two weapon slots, and i forget the other slots (i know that it is some combination of boot, belt and artifact, iirc)

Iggy 01-21-2009 07:59 PM

Foolstone, that's my exact problem. Example:

+1 def from Warrior Helmet (on the wife)
+2 def from Horned Helmet.
+3 def from Scaly Armor
+3 def from Kerian Shoes
+2 def from Guard's Shield
+2 def from Steel Belt
+2 def from 2 Altars of Combat


Which adds up to exactly 15. No 20% bonus to defense anywhere, otherwise the final defense score would be 18. I don't think poor translation is an issue in this case.

Ryastar 01-21-2009 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iggy (Post 65512)
Foolstone, that's my exact problem. Example:

+1 def from Warrior Helmet (on the wife)
+2 def from Horned Helmet.
+3 def from Scaly Armor
+3 def from Kerian Shoes
+2 def from Guard's Shield
+2 def from Steel Belt
+2 def from 2 Altars of Combat


Which adds up to exactly 15. No 20% bonus to defense anywhere, otherwise the final defense score would be 18. I don't think poor translation is an issue in this case.

Are you SURE that it isn't being applied to your troops directly? I'm pretty sure that is how it is supposed to work...

Stepsongrapes 01-21-2009 08:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iggy (Post 65512)
Foolstone, that's my exact problem. Example:

+1 def from Warrior Helmet (on the wife)
+2 def from Horned Helmet.
+3 def from Scaly Armor
+3 def from Kerian Shoes
+2 def from Guard's Shield
+2 def from Steel Belt
+2 def from 2 Altars of Combat


Which adds up to exactly 15. No 20% bonus to defense anywhere, otherwise the final defense score would be 18. I don't think poor translation is an issue in this case.

I believe that foolstone was indicating that the bonus is applied to your BASE defense, as unmodified by items. In your case, that seems like a whopping 2 defense.

Admittedly, I don't know if that's true or not (base vs. modified), but if I'm reading foolston right, that is a crappy bonus unless you take a TON of defense on level-up.

Alternatively, you're mis-remembering the altar bonuses and the game rounds down (20% of 13).

maltz 01-22-2009 06:24 AM

My intuition tells me the bonus applies to your base stats.
You can test it by:

1) Save the game
2) Remove all items on wife.

3) Use the cheat code "Levelup 30". Pick defense whenever you can. Your final defense = A.
4) Save the game "X"
5) Use the cheat code "Clearwife". Your no-child defense = B.

6) Load the game "X"
7) Strip naked. Your naked defense = C
8) Use the cheat code "Clearwife". Your naked defense = D

Now if the 20% bonus applies to naked + equipment defense,
A = B x 1.2

Now if the 20% bonus applies to naked defense only,
C = D x 1.2

Iggy 01-22-2009 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ryastar (Post 65513)
Are you SURE that it isn't being applied to your troops directly? I'm pretty sure that is how it is supposed to work...

Absolutely positive. I could post some screenshots for proof, but if I look at my troops directly each of them has +15 def. This is true whether they are in combat or on the world map.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Stepsongrapes (Post 65514)
Alternatively, you're mis-remembering the altar bonuses and the game rounds down (20% of 13).

I think we're onto something here, Stepsongrapes. If I strip myself down nekkid, I have a defense of 2. If I divorce the wife at that point, my defense goes to 1. To me, this implies that a) the bonus is applied to base defense, not total defense and b) that the bonus is rounded up.

And for the record, I was misremembering the number of altars. :eek:

So Maltz, sounds like your intuition was aboslutely right. ;)


And here I was thinking that percentage-based bonuses would scale better over the long game. I totally didn't expect this sort of behavior. Can anyone confirm that other stat bonuses (mana, int, atk) behave the same way? I know folks on the forum aren't too keen on children in the first place, but if this is working as designed? Add me to that list.

bmcelvan 10-08-2009 04:40 PM

okay so I did some experimenting with telescopic sight which adds 100% attack to archers...I have elves and hunters and tested there. It doesn't do anything for the total value you...it actually only works on the troops themselves...so for example id a hunter has an attack of 40(27) which means his value his 40 in your army but on his own his attack is 27, then that 27 is actually doubled to make 67. I haven't tested with defense of children yet but I suspect the same thing is happening there. So, you may only get an extra +1 attack with +20% attack child in your main stats page but I think your characters might also get an extra 20% to their own attack...when in combat...so check their personal attack values as well as the main page. Iggy, were your creatures big leadership creatures or low ranking creatures?


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