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Old 08-16-2012, 03:47 PM
BlackBerry BlackBerry is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2010
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Similarly, a 9lbs boost Tempest MkV could outdive and outzoom a 18lb spitfire XIV, although both have 2000HP engine.

We know tempest slightly outdive/outzoom P47D, spitfireXIV slightly outdive/outzoom spitfireIX.


In 1944 trials were made with the new Tempest Mk. V. The Tempest was fully compared with the nearest companion, the Typhoon IB. Tactical comparisons were also made with the Mustang III (P-51B), Spitfire XIV, Bf 109G and Fw 190. This is the report from the Air Fighting Development Unit at the R.A.F. station at Witter.
(Note: JN737, which was used for the tests, was a Tempest Mk. V Series I. version. I.e. without the spring-tab ailerons and the possibility to carry drop-tanks.)


Maximum Climb
The Tempest is not in the same class as the Spitfire XIV. The Tempest V however, has a considerably better zoom climb, holding a higher speed throughout the manoeuvre. If the climb is prolonged until climbing speed is reached, then, of course the Spitfire XIV will begin to catch and pull ahead.
The Tempest gains on the Spitfire XIV.
Interesting is that, in Raf Fighting Development Unit test in 1944, they found that Tempest hold high speed considerably better in zoom than spitfireXIV, but when speed drops to low to max climb speed, spitfireXIV will begin to catch up and then pull ahead(after sometime).

Very similar to Johnson's text about P47C vs SpitfireIX mock combat.

I estimate that 9lbs TempestMKV will beat a 18lbs SpitfireXIV with dive extension/pitch back tactic when spit is on tempest's 6 o'clock with same initial speed, same initial altitude,ie 1500m. Believe it or not.

Dive and zoom have different periods, a certain aircraft performance will vary at different period.

For example, 1943 Italy, p47 vs fw190g


(1) 10000 feet to 3000 feet, starting at 250 m.p.h., diving at angle of 65 degree with constant throttle setting. The FW-190 pulled away rapidly at the beginning but the P-47 passed it at 3000 ft with a much greater speed and had a decidedly better angle of pull out.
It is also possible that p47 outdives(better acceleration )spitfire at 400-800km/h speed range, but spitfire outdive or easier holding speed than p47 at 800-1000km/h.

On 5 February 1952, a Spitfire 19 of 81 Squadron based at Kai Tek in Hong Kong reached probably the highest altitude ever achieved by a Spitfire. The pilot, Flight Lieutenant Ted Powles,[123] was on a routine flight to survey outside-air temperature and report on other meteorological conditions at various altitudes in preparation for a proposed new air service through the area. He climbed to 50,000*ft (15,240*m) indicated altitude, with a true altitude of 51,550*ft (15,712*m). The cabin pressure fell below a safe level and, in trying to reduce altitude, he entered an uncontrollable dive which shook the aircraft violently. He eventually regained control somewhere below 3,000*ft (900*m) and landed safely with no discernible damage to his aircraft. Evaluation of the recorded flight data suggested that, in the dive, he achieved a speed of 690*mph (1,110*km/h, Mach*0.96), which would have been the highest speed ever reached by a propeller-driven aircraft, but it has been speculated this figure resulted from inherent instrument errors.[120]
That any operational aircraft off the production line, cannons sprouting from its wings and warts and all, could readily be controlled at this speed when the early jet aircraft such as Meteors, Vampires, P-80s, etc, could not, was certainly extraordinary.
Jeffrey Quill [124]
The critical Mach number of the Spitfire's original elliptical wing was higher than the subsequently-used laminar-flow-section, straight-tapering-planform wing of the follow-on Supermarine Spiteful, Seafang and Attacker, illustrating that Reginald Mitchell's practical engineering approach to the problems of high-speed flight had paid off.[125]

1)climb extension/pitch back : works fine in il2

2)dive extension/pitch back: works bad in il2

Sad news for allied P47,P51 and Tempest. Hope cliff of Dover bring us more accurate allied aircrafts.

Those lighter/small propeller Russian aircrafts should answer for their design style in boom and zoom.

Last edited by BlackBerry; 08-17-2012 at 12:27 AM.
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