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IL-2 Sturmovik The famous combat flight simulator.

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  #1  
Old 04-02-2013, 11:47 AM
martinistripes martinistripes is offline
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Question Why Can't I Keep Up?

Is it only me or is this normal? It doesn't matter what aircraft I fly, I can't keep up with the formation. I've tried playing with prop pitch and supercharger settings but I always end up behind, especially when in a bomber climbing to altitude. It feels like I'm on full engine management but the AI is on no overheat. To make things worse I keep getting all the 'What the hell! Stay with your leader...", messages. I would if I could!

Second question: When I fly a bomber, can the AI in my aircraft drop the bombs (like they fire the guns)? Or do I have to faff about jumping seats?

Thirdly: A request to the dev team. Can we have the gunners in bomber aircraft shoot at ground targets when at low altitude? The other day I dropped my bombs and missed. It was a transport column with no air defences so I flew low over it. By using the level stabiliser and quickly jumping to the belly gunner I was able to complete the mission after several passes. Would have been nice if the AI was switched on enough to engage the targets for me.

Very much looking forward to 4.12!
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  #2  
Old 04-02-2013, 02:26 PM
BadAim BadAim is offline
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Yes, this is normal. You have to keep your nose down to keep your speed up, then you will begin to catch up. You want to climb at "best climb speed" for your aircraft. This information can be found on the internet or here for most aircraft. You may also want to consult one of the "newb guides" for help as well.

It doesn't help that most missions have the AI blasting along at maximum speed all the time, it makes catching up very difficult.
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  #3  
Old 04-02-2013, 05:18 PM
majorfailure majorfailure is offline
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For aircraft performance data you want IL2compare.

I do think AI climb at speeds above best climb, for fighters at least they do. Let your plane gain some speed first after takeoff and then start to climb, do not point the nose at your leader initially. Prop pitch can remain at 100%/auto for a climb, supercharger needs to be switched at correct alt. If you don't know the altitude to switch: il2compare (speed vs. alt chart -speed minimum in the curve is a charger switch). To squeeze the last few % of performance from the plane use trim - it is easier to maintain a fairly constant speed using trim - remember the less you move the controls the less drag your plane produces. In time you will leave the AI behind when leading the flight.
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  #4  
Old 04-03-2013, 01:53 AM
IceFire IceFire is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by martinistripes View Post
Is it only me or is this normal? It doesn't matter what aircraft I fly, I can't keep up with the formation. I've tried playing with prop pitch and supercharger settings but I always end up behind, especially when in a bomber climbing to altitude. It feels like I'm on full engine management but the AI is on no overheat. To make things worse I keep getting all the 'What the hell! Stay with your leader...", messages. I would if I could!

Second question: When I fly a bomber, can the AI in my aircraft drop the bombs (like they fire the guns)? Or do I have to faff about jumping seats?

Thirdly: A request to the dev team. Can we have the gunners in bomber aircraft shoot at ground targets when at low altitude? The other day I dropped my bombs and missed. It was a transport column with no air defences so I flew low over it. By using the level stabiliser and quickly jumping to the belly gunner I was able to complete the mission after several passes. Would have been nice if the AI was switched on enough to engage the targets for me.

Very much looking forward to 4.12!
Do you have 4.11? If so.. the AI suffers from overheat now too. This was actually a bit of an issue in the beta for 4.11 as the AI was sometimes overheating their engine and ruining it... they didn't used to really contend with that kind of problem.

The way you fly is very important. A lot of people try and "follow" the aircraft ahead but what they are really doing is putting their nose higher, reducing their speed AND sinking below their best climb speed at which point the AI looks faster and faster. You can do this with humans too... formation flying between a couple of experienced pilots and some newer ones will show huge differences even when the aircraft types and fuel loads are identical.

There was no better highlight for me in this area than when I did a few for fun air races. Everyone in the same plane. Same fuel load. Same start time and yet some guys managed to complete the course significantly faster than the others. You can watch them pull away. It's all in their technique... sure it's engine management and keeping the engine as cool as possible while getting the most power. But it's also in how they angle their turns and what their inputs are on the stick. Smooth and steady inputs cause less drag than drastic and dramatic snap movements.

It's not really a secret but if you fly better then you will be faster. The AI is naturally gifted at this in some respects so they will climb at close to the ideal speed and angle and they will use the precise inputs (in most cases) to achieve the move they are programmed to perform. The AI does cheat... but with the changes in 4.11... it's more about the information they are armed with and the technique they use rather than any actual advantage over humans.

You can keep up with them
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  #5  
Old 04-03-2013, 06:15 AM
martinistripes martinistripes is offline
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I have the latest version. Don't think I ever noticed so much because I mostly played QMB and LAN. Years ago when I last played campaigns, I only flew IL-2s and don't remember it ever being an issue. Now, with the B25, He-111 and Hurricane campaigns, it's very noticable. I'm aware sharp stick movements will slow me down and I've been using the trim to climb steadily rather than in spurts, but I still lag. Would be nice if they weren't so ruthlessly efficient or their cruising speed was reduced just a touch. Then I wouldn't have to be the flight leader.

Part of the reason might be I'm seperated from my stick and peddles at the moment and using an old thustmaster gamepad. It's dual analog, and I assigned trim controls to the D-pad. Of course, it's no substitute for a stick.
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  #6  
Old 04-03-2013, 05:33 PM
Pursuivant Pursuivant is offline
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On some maps or missions cruising speeds are set at unrealistically high speeds, so it can take some time to catch up.
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  #7  
Old 04-04-2013, 04:04 AM
MaxGunz MaxGunz is offline
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What you must do is get moving before you climb after the others. Get up, get wheels up, get flaps up and trim trim trim the whole time. Don't even shallow climb until you're faster than whatever waypoint cruise speed your flight plan is. You want to catch up on the horizontal more than on the vertical. They will be cruising at 70% or less speeds.

The faster you go, the more lift you get out of a little more AOA. Nose down and slow, excess lift is small and more AOA slows you down more. 240-270 kph is not the speed to climbout. More like 360 if your flight plan says 340. Then you rise only as much as you can maintain 350 kph.

Pretty soon you get co-alt and then just zoom up and try to slide into position without sliding right on past. IL2 planes-at-distance graphics isn't the best for judging distances and speeds. I liked Rowan's MiG Alley Ace for the detailed planes, IMO looked better than the IL2 LOD's at the same virtual range, what they are and what they are doing is more clear.

When you turn, rise or fall during the turn. If you are going very fast and want to turn, zoom climb steeply then roll until your canopy points where you want to go and you have changed direction quicker than you can fly a flat curve and you have height to dive from and regain your original speed.

If you're not at high speed and turning to make contact with enemy let your plane drop 100-150m alt in the first half of the turn, speeding up and a slightly tighter turn than a flat turn would have been, and finish the turn in a shallow climb. You can come out moving faster than you started. Even going straight-line, unload the wings a few full seconds to lower induced drag. Your speed picks up quick going downhill. Then regain alt slowly while still building speed.

One long hard turn and it's start over, too. Gain alt once you're really moving, it's money in the bank of physics. Just whatever you do, don't fly around nose-high and slow. In IL-2 you must trim all the time for minimum PC joystick deflection. Bud Anderson wrote of constant trimwheel adjusting during combat in WWII P-51's. He detailed the action as automatic, like tuning a radio while driving a car.

Last is check The Ball if you still can't get speed up. Then flaps. Then gear.
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  #8  
Old 04-04-2013, 04:12 PM
K_Freddie K_Freddie is offline
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Don't forget some Engine Management..

Once you get some speed up, throttle back and set prop pitch for optimum settings (usually 60/60, but a/c dependent). This will allow you to close your radiator a few notches, which gives you some extra mph's.

If you take notice of the AI props, they're usually not spinning at max which is an indication that they using CEM.
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  #9  
Old 04-08-2013, 09:21 PM
MaxGunz MaxGunz is offline
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Expect to catch your formation well before a reasonable waypoint. Once you can stay joined, you will be running reduced engine and prop. Work on lower prop speed, you can have 120+% power to 100% RPM which is over-square. But try keeping nose down until you have gained good speed method without using more than 80% power. It will still work.

The hard part is cutting back on power soon enough to just merge into formation moving 320-360kph. Crabbing to slow down does work. Crab is wings tilt one way, rudder goes the other way, plane loses speed.
Better is to not get over 400kph on the way to formation, start cutting throttle and rpm as you approach. Once close, even at 20kph faster you'd better be slowing down.

My usual experience is keep nose down, get speed, rise to formation alt already going 380-400kph and gain speed on the 360kph dots. Usually by the time the dots start getting bigger I'm going way too fast and just shoot on past the flight even while slowing down, then go back and fit into my spot.

Once you're moving you can usually keep speed up on reduced rpm and power. You should get a cooler engine that way.
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  #10  
Old 06-27-2013, 11:36 AM
martinistripes martinistripes is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by martinistripes View Post
Second question: When I fly a bomber, can the AI in my aircraft drop the bombs (like they fire the guns)? Or do I have to faff about jumping seats?

Thirdly: A request to the dev team. Can we have the gunners in bomber aircraft shoot at ground targets when at low altitude? The other day I dropped my bombs and missed. It was a transport column with no air defences so I flew low over it. By using the level stabiliser and quickly jumping to the belly gunner I was able to complete the mission after several passes. Would have been nice if the AI was switched on enough to engage the targets for me.
Can anyone clarify on my second point? I don't suppose there'd be any changes to points two and three with the release of 4.12?
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