1C Home   |   Register   |   Today Posts   |   Members   |   UserCP   |   Calendar   |   Search   |   FAQ

Go Back   Official 1C Company forum > 1C Publishing > IL-2 Sturmovik: Cliffs of Dover > Technical threads

Technical threads All discussions about technical issues

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 03-29-2011, 10:58 AM
adonys adonys is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 850
Default The anti-epilepsy filter and Luthier/UBI statements

This is for all of us to understand better what's this about, and what's the current situations of it. I gave up having to explain it in countless threads across multiple forums.


Guys, you need the facts, first before anything, and the facts at this moment are the following:

- MG (Maddox Games) started to address epilepsy issues in IL2 at UBI's request
- they've put out of the game (previously announced as for good, as in forever) some of them (there's no list of this, just Luthier's statement, but it included the cockpit view propeller's arc) - in both IL2 CoD and BoB
- at the point MG understood there's no time to address them all before release, they've stopped addressing the effects individually and started to put up the full screen filter - in both IL2 CoD and BoB

- after we've found out, and due to rampage on the forums, Luthier said 1C version BoB will accept an optional filter (or even removing it for good) and stop individually addressing effects to meet epilepsy requirements, but the UBI version CoD will have the filter permanent (or at least until all effects will be addressed individually, making the filter obsolete)
- Luthier also said that it might re-add/un-cripple the list of individual effects already modified to meet the epilepsy requirement in the 1C's BoB version before turning to the filter solution (yet, it might not equals for sure)
- after more ranting UBI sais it will make the filter optional

BUT

- making the filter optional doesn't mean they won't further continue to address (read cripple) effects individually in order to meet epilepsy requirements
- and even if they stop further individually addressing the effects, it also doesn't mean they will re-add/un-cripple the already modified effects crippled to meet the epilepsy requirements


We need an official clarification of these two problems from UBI/Luthier in order to consider the CoD at par with BoB

Of course, all of the above assuming UBI is not just lying to us in order to not drop the launch sales. We can only have faith in their word, and check it in time, by comparing the visuals from the two different editions (Cod vs BoB)..
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 03-29-2011, 10:59 AM
adonys adonys is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 850
Default

Oh god, nobody seems to really understand.. Ok, let's do it the hard way:

We have this awesome propeller blade arc visible from inside the cockpit, right?

As we've seen in WW2 footage, the propeller view is like a translucid (like in transparent, but not invisible) circle seen all the time while not at very low rpm, with some blurred propeller blades rotating at slower speeds inside/over the translucid arc, sometime even counter-rotating (an optical illusion seen at rpms which would have the propeller move just a little less than full 360 degrees during a single frame, hence the illusion of counter-rotating). Everyone with me until now?!

Now, UBI comes and says: we can't have these blurred propeller blades rotating, or even counter-rotating, inside the propeller's translucid arc, it will cause headache and might trigger epilepsy, remove it.

MG removed them from the game. Removed the blurred slowly rotating/counter-rorating propeller blades for good (like in removing them from the game, and deleting the resources needed to create them), and just kept only the translucid arc.

After 100 x above, they've decided is counterproductive to fix all the individual requests, and added an epilepsy filter.

Do you have the slightest idea what that (post-processing) filter is? it is NOT like a list of effects which are allowed when it is on, and not rendered when it is off. it is NOT a list of effectes rendered like this when it is on, and like that when it is off.

The filter just grabs the image which should go to the screen, and analysis it pixel by pixel with the previously image sent to the screen. if the difference between the luminosity of two pixels is too big, it will tone down it in the new image is preparing to send to the screen.

Do you understand now what "epilepsy filter removal means"? it means only it will stop analyse and modify the rendered image, and send it as it is to the screen.

while being a good thing (as it will put back into the game the extra FPS removed by this filter, and preserve a more contrasting look of the game), it won't put the already crippled effects back in, as the already removed inside cockpit slowly rotating/counter-rotating blurred propeller's blades. That won't put back ANY of the individual already removed/toned down/crippled effects.

Even more, it won't mean UBI might not request to have other/more effects removed/crippled/toned down (in order to limit the worst of them if the epilepsy filter is taken off)..

Do you understand now?

Last edited by adonys; 03-29-2011 at 11:04 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 03-29-2011, 11:08 AM
robtek's Avatar
robtek robtek is offline
Approved Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,816
Default

@adonys

In this simulation the real view is simulated!!!
Not the view of a camera!!
So no slow counterrotating props or such stuff!
Except maybe in a track where a camera is simulated.
__________________
Win 7/64 Ult.; Phenom II X6 1100T; ASUS Crosshair IV; 16 GB DDR3/1600 Corsair; ASUS EAH6950/2GB; Logitech G940 & the usual suspects
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 03-29-2011, 11:10 AM
Bowtome Bowtome is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 56
Default

No, I don't but thanks and very bored with 100 threads a day being created.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 03-29-2011, 11:12 AM
T}{OR's Avatar
T}{OR T}{OR is offline
Approved Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Zagreb, Croatia
Posts: 833
Default

+1

An official statement on this would indeed be helpful.
__________________

LEVEL BOMBING MANUAL v2.0 | Dedicated Bomber Squadron
'MUSTANG' - compilation of online air victories
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 03-29-2011, 11:20 AM
adonys adonys is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 850
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vevster View Post
Yes, a lot of might / might not in your post, and lot of assumptions


You say Ubi asked for individual effects to be taken of, assumption. They tested the game on standard seizure tests; failed, go back to dev.

You assume again that the dev team removed some effects, nothing from Luthier hints to that. He did say that they would have to do that in the future if Ubi didn't change its stance on the whole epilepsy thing.
Since Ubi changed it and said OK, make the removal of the filter an option, put a warning, no need to rework the effects.

Think: why would the filter stay, even as an option, if the effects had to be reworked? That would be a double barrier.
You can actually read Luthier's statements and explanations on this russian forum. I haven't made up anything from this, they are Luthier's explanations. You are the one making assumptions in here, not me, sorry.

Also, you did not understand that after modifying the effects for a while, they saw can't address them all (as Luthier said, the whole damn game and almost everything from it could potentially cause epilepsy), they've left the already modified/removed ones as they were, and added a filter on the final rendered image, as a quick solution for launch (as UBI said there won't be any UBI launch without all the potential epilepsy causing effects removed from the game).

Luthier also said this filter will be removed once ALL epilepsy causing effects will be modified individually (after weeks/months of painful work). His words, not mine.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 03-29-2011, 11:21 AM
adonys adonys is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 850
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by robtek View Post
Afaik it is you who doesnt understand.

In this simulation the real view is simulated!!!
Not the view of a camera!!
So no slow counterrotating props or such stuff!
Except maybe in a track where a camera is simulated.
The effect is not visible only on camera, I just gave WW2 footage as an example, as most of us saw it in there, and not in real life. But the effect is perfectly observable by looking with your own eyes, and from Luthier's words, it was modeled into the game (and then removed as part of UBI's anti epilepsy requests).

The closest alike effect would be the one caused by the spikes from a car wheels' plastic protectors (I don't know the exact english word for these, I'm sorry, but english is not my native language). At certain rotation speeds, you'll have the optical illusion that the wheel is actually rotating backwards.

You, sir, are wrong!
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 03-29-2011, 11:22 AM
Gamekeeper Gamekeeper is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 190
Default

Making the filter switchable does not automatically mean that effects already removed will not be added back in. As Luthier has stated there will be more information available as and when patches are released. Let's address problems when they actually occur rather than always assume the worst is inevitable. As Ubisoft have adopted a logical calm approach to the situation I doubt they will be demanding more toning down as the anti epilepsy warnings and switch are in place by default which fulfil their obligations so far as PSE is concerned.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 03-29-2011, 11:26 AM
adonys adonys is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 850
Default

That's exactly what I've did, I haven't assumed anything, but asked for an answer from Luthier/UBI to clarify the matter for us all.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 03-29-2011, 11:29 AM
BigPickle
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by adonys View Post
You can actually read Luthier's statements and explanations on this russian forum. I haven't made up anything from this, they are Luthier's explanations. You are the one making assumptions in here, not me, sorry.

Also, you did not understand that after modifying the effects for a while, they saw can't address them all (as Luthier said, the whole damn game and almost everything from it could potentially cause epilepsy), they've left the already modified/removed ones as they were, and added a filter on the final rendered image, as a quick solution for launch (as UBI said there won't be any UBI launch without all the potential epilepsy causing effects removed from the game).

Luthier also said this filter will be removed once ALL epilepsy causing effects will be modified individually (after weeks/months of painful work). His words, not mine.
Mate seriously drop this topic now its getting real old, you have quoted his words,"they will fix/modify each effect" end of dit so just wait.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 09:14 AM.

Based on a design by: Miner Skinz.com

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2007 1C Company. All rights reserved.